The Long and The Short Of It

Episode 101 - Raise the Bar

Transcript:

Jen: Hello, Peter.

Pete: Hello, Jen.

Jen: It's Episode 101.

Pete: Boom.

Jen: And if I recall, back in Episode 99, we talked about our need to, from Episode 101 on, raise the bar and level up.

Pete: Hmm. No pressure, no pressure.

Jen: Well, I thought maybe before we do that we should figure out what the hell we're talking about when we say, "Raise the bar and level up."

Pete: Sounds like a smart move. This is The Long and The Short Of It.

Pete: Alright Jennifer, what does "raise the bar" mean to you?

Jen: "Raise the bar" means strive for more than you were striving for before. Recognize that the edge of your potential has shifted and work to the new edge. Take bigger risks. Challenge yourself. Follow the fear. All of that would fall under the "raise the bar" umbrella.

Pete: Hmm. I like the notion of follow the fear and take bigger risks, and the way that you describe that. I think that it feels so much more healthy than raising the bar being like, "Get more downloads," or "Get more likes on our Instagram posts," or like...that, I think, in this clickbait fast-paced media culture that we're living in at the moment that like, when a lot of people think of, like, better, they think of more likes, or more downloads, or more something, and I so love how casually you were just like, "Take bigger risks." Which is almost counterintuitive to like, "Do the things that people expect you to do."

Jen: Mmm.

Pete: And so, I really like that. And follow the fear, which also feels like counter to, "Get more likes. Get more downloads."

Jen: Well, I think you're onto something...and my brain was not even going in that direction, but now it is. So, thank you very much. That if you are raising the bar without paying attention to who you're raising it for, or for what reason, then of course all you're going to focus on is how many clicks, how many likes, how many downloads. Like, you know, when I think about raising the bar, I'm thinking about creating better content.

Pete: Hmm.

Jen: And if that results in more likes, or shares, or downloads, great. But what I really am thinking about are the people who have been listening, who we made a promise to that we would raise the bar for them.

Pete: Yeah. Serve them even more generously. I feel like is how I want to interpret that. Yeah.

Jen: Yeah.

Pete: And do you think "level up" has a similar kind of connotation? I know that we've used that phrase quite a bit too.

Jen: Okay. So here's, here's the thing with level up.

Pete: Hit me.

Jen: I think it's a somewhat problematic phrase that I often use and then regret using later.

Pete: Me too. Me too.

Jen: Okay, okay, then we're on the same page about this.

Pete: Yeah, yeah.

Jen: Can we talk about why that is?

Pete: Yeah, I had a recent aha moment about this. So, let's go. Let's talk about it.

Jen: I mean, I think it plays in to existing hierarchy and conformity.

Pete: Yes. Yeah. This myth I've been thinking about a lot. In fact, not this myth, this story that we (society, culture, and organizations in particular) tell ourselves and tell the world about hierarchy as being this like, like a step, like a series of steps. And you...when I think of level up, you've like, you've taken another step on that hierarchy, on that staircase. And I think that's very unhealthy and very unproductive if we think about it too much in that context, because it's automatically assuming, I think, status in terms of the higher on the step ladder you are, the more status you hold, the "better" you are, or the more successful you are. And so, I would love to just challenge...it's not that I want to get rid of the term "level up" because I think it has got potential to be really helpful with the right definition.

Jen: Yeah.

Pete: But I certainly still think of like, "We're going up stairs. And the higher on the staircase I am, the better." And I don't think that's productive, healthy at all, especially given the state of the world at the moment.

Jen: Yeah, I'm so in alignment with what you're saying. And when I hear it come out of my mouth, I'm always like, "Couldn't I have chosen a better way to describe that?" Because "level up" assumes that you are at the level down, and that you're like assuming this position about yourself where you have less power or agency in some way to move through whatever structure you're talking about.

Pete: With the right definition, it can be productive. Like if it's, I feel like the umbrella of so many of the things we talk about is like, "How do we be the best version of ourselves?"

Jen: Yes.

Pete: "How do we get clear on the stories we're telling ourselves so that we can be more generous, more, you know, committed, compassionate, more empathetic, more productive, whatever that means to us?" And so, I feel like it's a bit like...honestly, in my head, the visual that I'm coming up with now is a bit like The Arena episode where we said, "We all have our own individual arenas." It's almost like we all have our own...I'm loath to call it a staircase, but in this case my head's been in the story of a staircase. But it's not a shared staircase. It's not a shared path. We're all on our own one. So whatever "better" looks like for us is entirely different to what it looks like for someone else. And so, that version of level up I could get down with, which is leveling up to be a better version of myself, if that makes sense.

Jen: Mm-hmm. This is reminding me of this experience I had with a friend of mine who was helping me sort of envision a future for the studio. This was several years ago. And I was talking about my dream (which is still my dream) of creating a tuition-free institution where world-class artists could continue to hone their craft, without it causing them to have to make choices that are really unhealthy for their lives about how they're going to invest. And this dream involves patrons of the arts supporting continued training for world-class artists. Okay, so he said, "Well, what is it going to take for you to do that?" And I threw a number out there, I was like, "I don't know. $5 million dollars, $10 million, something like that." And he said, "Okay, well, what if tomorrow someone came to you and said, 'Here's a check for $10 million.' And they made it really easy for you. Would you take it?" And my response was, "No. I don't know that person. I don't know what they care about. I don't know where that money is coming from. I don't know what their agenda is." And he was like, "Oh, so it's not about the money. It's about aligning people around an idea that you are inviting them to support." And I was like, "Yes!" That's...when I think about raising the bar, the thing that I like about it is it's my bar. And it's coming from the things that I care about, and things I'm passionate about, the things that I value, as opposed to level up feels like I'm almost trying to put myself into someone else's world. I don't know how else to describe it. But there is like an individual agency or ownership of having something to believe in that resonates with me when I say, "Raise the bar." And it doesn't resonate quite as much when I use the term "level up".

Pete: Okay, so I think this ties into the aha moment I had recently. Let me just see if we can connect this. So, I have been in a certain leadership position within one of the organizations that I'm involved in for a couple years. And we talk and have talked about how we don't want it to have status within that community. We want it to be like a game of basketball, or a court, you know, a basketball team where everyone's playing a different role. You might be a point guard, you might be a center, you might be a power forward, but there's no like one position is more important or "better" than the other. Now, we've talked about that. However, I just feel like because of everything that we just talked about, because of society, because of culture, because of titles, there can't help it be a little bit of friction, a little bit of status created because you have a leadership team who ultimately needs to make decisions for and on behalf of the community. So, that's been something we've always talked about. And talked about as a result of that, we need for us to create, essentially, like some sort of rotational system, where everyone gets to sit in that leadership team. Everyone gets an opportunity, if they want to, and they feel inspired to or called to, to have a seat at the table. And so, we've started to enact that policy. And for those that are willing, and able, and want to, and have the time have stepped into that role. And so my turn has come to rotate out. And even though I helped get clear in why we were doing that, because of, I guess, the way that society tells us these stories, I'm like not super proud to admit that my ego kicked in at the first point and was like, "Did you just level down? Did you just level down by stepping out of a leadership role back into the community?" And pretty quickly I checked myself. And I had a really brilliant, honest conversation with a friend of both of ours, Rebecca Channer, actually. And she just said something so off-the-cuff that was so perfect, which was exactly what I needed to hear. And it was, "Yeah, but did the system level up? Did the community level up in you leveling down?" And so I feel like to tie this to what you just said, when raising the bar is in pursuit of something bigger than ourselves, a community, a change, a vision that we have of the world that we want to create, it's so much more generous than if we're focused on our individual selves "leveling up". Does that make sense?

Jen: Yes, and it really is bringing home for me this idea that you and I have talked about this quite a lot both on this show and offline, which is having a purpose, a vision, a reason behind everything that you're doing. And so when I think about how does that relate then to this podcast as an example, which we said, "We're going to level up." So, what...? Or that, "We're going to raise the bar." What does that actually mean for the podcast? Because, I mean, we haven't actually talked about this offline. We haven't said like, "Now we're going to make them twenty-one minutes."

Pete: An extra minute!

Jen: Right? So it's, it's not about necessarily even changing the format, but it's about raising the bar in pursuit of this thing that we care about (which we have talked about ad nauseum), which is we want to help people who have changemaking ideas have the tools to share their ideas. That we want to be able to help people who have the capacity to create change to have the tools (internal and external) to create that change. So when I think about, "What does leveling up mean right now," that means seek new ways to help people get the tools they need in order to make the change they seek to make.

Pete: Yeah. Yes. Yes, yes, yes. So, stay tuned for what that might look like.

Jen: Got any ideas, Pete?

Pete: I think, not to double-back, I think the thread worth just re-highlighting...whether you can, I don't even know if you can re-highlight a thread, but here I am. Is that like, we are all human and we'll all probably get caught up at some point and trip up over this idea. And I call myself out as someone who did this. Like, the example I used before was I helped create the purpose of why we will rotate. I helped like articulate why that's important to the community. Like, I helped define, basically, what it means for the community to level up. And yet, I still had that like unproductive ego thought the moment it happened, of like, "Did you just level down?" And so I just want to like, I don't know, normalize it, maybe is the right term. But just to say, even when we have the vision, even when we're clear on what it means to, you know, "level up" or raise the bar for a community, there's probably going to be moments where we catch ourselves getting stuck or tripped up on our own ego. I mean, to use the podcast (again, as an example), there will undoubtedly be moments where I check our downloads and I'm like, "Jen, we didn't get as many new downloads as we thought we might." And you'll probably remind me like, "Who cares? Who cares? It's not about the numbers, Pete. It's about the change." And I'll be like, "Cool, cool, cool. You're right." So, I feel like just acknowledging that it's a process, and a thrash, and ego is forever getting in the way.

Jen: Mmm. Yeah, I think that's an important call in. And P.S., that's why you're the one checking the numbers and not me. [laughter] Because I don't want to get caught up in it, because I know I would. I know I would. So there's another point that we brought up at the beginning, which I feel like is important to unpack a little bit. And that's the idea of running toward fear.

Pete: Mmm, yes.

Jen: That one of the reasons you know it's time to raise the bar is because it's not that scary to be where you are anymore.

Pete: You're comfortable. Yeah.

Jen: Yeah. And so, I love this idea that you would use, as my friend Steve Pacek always says, "Use fear as the compass to point you where you need to go."

Pete: So good.

Jen: Yeah, run towards the fear. Run towards the bang, as you have said to me a million times.

Pete: Yeah.

Jen: Which, I think what's important about that is when you think about raise the bar, there really is a sort of vertical image in place where like something is going higher off the ground.

Pete: Yeah.

Jen: But what's interesting about using fear as a compass is that it doesn't necessarily have to feel like you are elevating somehow, in order to run toward the fear and raise the latitudinal bar. [laughter] Or, you know what I mean? Like, there is this sort of an image associated with raise the bar where it's like, "I have to go higher." But sometimes raise the bar could actually mean, "I have to go deeper. Or, I have to go farther."

Pete: Yeah. Or maybe there's a different bar, I was thinking. Like, maybe if you just turn left there's, "Oh, there's a bar over here too. I haven't thought about jumping over that bar."

Jen: Mmm. Yep. Yeah. Okay, so now we have to get into like, "We're standing inside a six-sided cube. And in every direction, we could be moving the edges, pushing ourselves in lots of different directions." So let's just not get caught up in the idea that we have to be going higher, higher, higher. There is, there are many directions to go toward better.

Pete: Yes. And I think that question that your friend highlights, or that metaphor of using fear as a compass is so critical. I was asked just yesterday by a coach and a leader that I really respect...I was presenting her with like, "Here are a bunch of options that I see on what we could do, you know, as a team, as a community." This is one of the groups I work with. And she very generously heard me read out, you know, my eight options. And like, I could tell I should have known the question was coming, and I love that it came, which was like, "Okay, cool. I mean, you've got eight options, but which one's the most scary?" And I was like, "Okay, it's this one." And so, I suspect that's the one that we're going to move forward with because it's the most scary. So I think that question for our listeners to ask, which is a juicy one, which is like, "Of all of the possible options you may have, or of all the ways you could serve your community or take a risk, which one feels the most scary?"

Jen: Mmm. Okay, so it feels like it's time to bring this one home.

Pete: Bring it home.

Jen: We're committing and asking our listeners to commit to, to identifying the ways that we can raise our own bar (in whatever direction) so that we can take more risks, push ourselves outside of our comfort zones, step into fear, dance with imposter syndrome, and move our work forward so that we can have the quality and size of impact that we want to have. That we can make the change we seek to make. It's time to raise the bar.

Pete: Hmm. And that feels like The Long and The Short Of It.